But with extra trains.

 
It was definitely the busiest day in Weymouth so far. Ironic that it was a Sunday timetable on the trains!

 
the news is reporting the beach at weymouth had to be closed to further visitors with 15000 people said to be there on the beach

 
Indeed, but today Weymouth has seen something near the crowds they were expecting during the sailing events so i'd expect SWT, FGW and XC have had a busier day today.

 
It's also possible that the train was formed of 5 carriages, but that one was unavailable for use because of vandalism to it. The platforms would have been too short to take 6 carriages. Loadings the last week to Weymouth have not been that large either apparently.

 

There's an extra train an 18:26 from Weymouth to Bristol (and Cardiff) ... probably five extra carriages, and First will have had the benefit of knowing whether the crowds going down this morning were big enough to require sending something more down.   The 17:56, last high summer, was five (or even six) carriages on a Sunday - dividing at Westbury for Bristol and Cheltenham via Swindon.  The two / three carriages forward to Bristol left Westbury around 40% loaded; it was the Swindon / Cheltenham section, which also varied between 2 and 3 coaches, which was - err - overloaded.  The metrics are different this year; without a connection from Swindon to Weymouth in the morning, the 17:56 doesn't need to be a maximum-length train to get those particular returning crowds home.

So - summary - probably no need to get an extra carriage down ... and it would have been 2 extras unless there was a 153 available, which would have  meant replatforming at Weymouth as the FGW platform only takes 5 cars.

 
Not a good day to have services short formed with many expected to head to Weymouth with two medal races taking place today. I can understand it being difficult to source an extra carriage at short notice for the 09.20 but surely FGW can get an extra carriage down to Weymouth in time for the 17.56 especially as it's Sunday?

 

Set from Reading was a Turbo

 

1M78 is a double set from Bomo but is only single manned so will be running with one unit locked out of use.

 

Looks like it was planned to happen again this week - only now it has been extended to Reading.  Any bets on whether the additional train from Reading to London Paddington is, in fact, the same set?

 

This confirms what the Area Operations Manager (FGW) told me at Weymouth on Monday that the plan might change if Weymouth numbers didn't warrant, the set would be used for the football in Cardiff.

 

According to Journeycheck the amended service has er... been amended....

 

An it should be added that 1O02, 1O04, 1M74 and 1M78 all run as double Voyager sets until/from Bournemouth, so, Sunday apart, well done XC.

 

Here's the Manchester-Weymouth XC on Monday (5-car 221), alongside a SWT 159/158 5-car combination on the Bournemouth-Weymouth shuttle.

 

1O02 0604 BMH-WEY 4 car
1O04 0511 MAN-WEY 5 car
1Z80 1135 WEY-BMH 5 car
1Z81 1235 BMH-WEY 5 car
1M74 1741 WEY-MAN 5 car
1M78 1830 WEY-BHM 4 car

Was today's offering.

The fifth HST is never really a spare but receiving scheduled maintenance at Craigentinny. Unlike a lot of TOCs where fleets have some downtime in between the peaks, XC are dealing with peaks in tens of cities across the country and the fleet are generally in use from the time they leave the depot in the morning to the time they return at night. For example at EC the last set for NES-SW working comes off shed at approximately 0600 and the first one back at night is approximately 2230. The times are slightly later for the daily EDB-RDG and SOU-EDB workings which are outside the core and partially due to capacity issues at Tyne Yard.

The Weymouth workings are obviously an important event, but not at the front of the minds of people trying to get to work or go on holiday. The reason why some of the workings are a four car is that the four car will have already been scavenged from services which would generally run in the summer as an eight car, they in turn will be running five v eight and in turn there will be diagrams running four v five.

As for running HSTs on the route, the long swing link bogies have already been covered. Add to this the fact that Bournemouth Drivers and Train Managers don't sign HSTs, Reading Train Managers don't sign HSTs, Birmingham Drivers and Train Managers that DO sign HSTs don't sign the route from Birmingham to Reading or Bournemouth, Manchester Train Managers and Longsight Drivers who sign the route as far as Reading don't sign HSTs!

The train managers working Weymouth trains from Bournemouth learned the route on a volunteer basis in consultation with the unions (as they will be off their usual booked workings for the course of the Olympics) and drivers likewise. The drivers were generally ex SWT drivers that joined in the last intake and had therefore recently signed Weymouth.

In the world of BR traincrew depots would know most traction and stock that passed through their station but in these days it just isn't feasible.

 
People seem to be forgetting that Weymouth isn't normally served by XC, so the fact they have provided what they have is a good thing surely...

 
How likely is one to fail for two weeks of the Games? (or how ever long the sailing is on for)

If they can't run to Weymouth, get all 5 out and free a Voyager to go to Weymouth/make a Weymouth 8 car.

 
They can't run them over third rail anyway as some of the coaches are fitted with Long Swing Link bogies which can't be used over third rail.

 
The XC HSTs stable every night at Leeds Neville Hill or Edinburgh Craigentinny. Care a share a diagram for Weymouth that XC could do that would get the set home every night? Four sets are used on regular timetabled services on a daily basis at the moment, with the necessary one in reserve to cover those four sets in case of failure.

They could use the 'spare', but what happens if one of the regular diagrammed sets fails? Cancel a regular timetabled service on NE-SW?

 
XC should run an HST to Weymouth. Get all 5 out.

 
The Voyager fleet should have a bit of slack in it for the Summer, two extra HST diagrams have been reinstated from June to September.

 

Given that it was a Sunday, I'm sure that the resources for two 4-cars could have been found.  The weekday timetable is different of course, but it does appear that tonight's two return services have run as 9-car trains (after attaching to another unit in both cases at Bournemouth).  Assuming the whole lot were in service that is good work from XC.

 
Where are XC extra resources meant to come from ?   A regular question.   XC are already having to provide additional resouces to cover the trains between Bournemouth and Weymouth.

 
You could say that the 8 similar 12 coach trains sitting at London terminals every night are a waste of resources too. It isn't just FGW who are doing something like this.

 
The other side of the coin, as it were, is that if FGW are programming it, it is a shame that it's not advertised as running from Weymouth. It left Weymouth virtually empty. If passengers had known it was running they might have preferred to have left Weymouth later and travelled in greater comfort back to Bristol than on the 150/153 combination of the scheduled service which left some 40 minutes earlier. What a waste of resources!

 

Not just the printed timetables ... the timetable (.pdf) on www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk (table 5, until 14th September) shows it as running throughout the timetable's validity.

So the next direct train from Paddington to Trowbridge and Bradford-on-Avon runs on 13th August?  .

I'm not critical of the decision to run it on to Westbury and Weymouth after its Pewsey call ... just sad that the change which I would imagine has been planned for a long time didn't make it to the printed timetable, and very surprised that even as I write the FGW website still shows (in the "authority" place) the 17:06 as running to Bristol all through the next weeks.

 
This is something I have come across before on other services and is very annoying.  There is no mention I can find on the printed timetable nor the website concerning this change with the 17:06.  It is all well and good putting it on journey planners but if someone has the printed timetable and then consults engineering notices etc and finds nothing they should expect the timetabled service to run as per the leaflet they have.

This happened last week to the last evening service from Taunton to London Paddington.  For one day only it terminated at Swindon - but again no mention anywhere except Journeyplanner.

I'm not saying Weymouth shouldn't have an extra service but other customers need to know so they can be prepared.

 

The HST arrives from the 1706 London Paddington - Bristol Temple Meads service on a weekday, which is terminating at Westbury during the Olympics and has a booked ECS from Westbury. The service does not need to run as it is unadvertised and will just run back empty if not required.

 
Live Departures have shown it will be running for at least the last 90 minutes. I'd be disappointed if I'd check times on an app whilst enjoying the late evening sunshine in Weymouth and decided to catch the 2053 to Bristol from Weymouth rather than the 2009, only to get to the station and find it wasn't running.

 
It's a relief for the 2021(2009 SuO) Weymouth-Bristol Temple Meads, the last advertised service to Bristol. It will only run in passenger service if the advertised service is too busy. There are additional services from London working in the same way. The TOCs have advertised later service trains to a number of destinations and DBS are providing rakes of MK2s with Class 67 or 90 locomotives as standbys to run if the service trains are too busy.

 
The down Weymouth HST is definitely running this evening. Left Castle Cary 14 late at 19.40.

 

Yeah ... could have fill that today from Swindon without the Olympics  .  Understandable decision not to run from Swindon / Chippenham / Melksham today. Pity it had to kill the whole season for us ...

 
XC's token offering of the day, an 18:38 Weymouth to Birmingham New Street service has been provided by a 4-Car Voyager.  They couldn't even be bothered rostering a 5-Car on it, let alone an 8/9/10 car.  I'm not sure whether that's due to the number of people down there today, or just because XC are a pretty lethargic and shoddy TOC!

 
The incoming service to Weymouth from Cardiff (actually Bristol today) was packed. It consists of 3 x 153 and 1 x150. Same back this evening.

 
This HST is programmed to arrive at Weymouth at 20.41 from St Philips Marsh Depot, but will only run at the discretion of the Operations Manager, who told me this morning he wasn't sure tonight, as numbers didn't seem to warrant it going into Weymouth this morning.

 
Interesting to see mention of 2Z49 as an extra HST working. If  this really is/was a planned service how is the Great British Public supposed to know about it. No sign of any publicity that I can detect.

What are the inbound working arrangments??

 

Because it works well enough for normal demands plus known peaks such as Weymouth Carnival and Bournemouth airshow. Why waste ^millions for a few weeks of possible high demand during the Olympics when you can temporarily bring in other diesel traction (158/159 & 220/221) to bolster services?

Plus the recent Basing - Soton Docks OHLE announcements probably mean 3rd rail is dead in the medium/longer term anyway.

 
Why on earth didn't they upgrade the power supply in the past 7 years?

 
8-car class 450 ran into Weymouth on the 07.35 from London Waterloo today, very well-filled.

 
SWT 159/158 ran into Weymouth this morning from Bournemouth, lightly filled.  Train returned ECS to Bournemouth.

Spoke to FGW Area Operations Manager in Weymouth this morning who said that the FGW HST programmed to leave Weymouth each evening as 2Z97 at 20.49 weekdays 20.53 Sundays will only run if numbers demand. He felt that passenger numbers may not be high enough today.

 

I thought SWT have said otherwise, because NR had allowed the DC system to be temporarily overloaded: 


Nonetheless, my hypothetical strengthened 10 car 444 would not necessarily have to run beyond Bournemouth.   Substituting any 5.444 with a DMU still allows extra overall capacity on the line, because the displaced unit could allow for a 5 car service from Waterloo to Bournemouth to become a 10 car to Bournemouth, IYSWIM...

Paul

 

It is not possible for anything longer than 5 cars to run beyond Poole, even if the other 5 car 444 services are replaced. Yesterday a group of units went empty to Bournemouth from Salisbury ready for these services, it was formed of 10 carriages 2 159s and 2 158s I believe.

These are what the additional 158s and 159s are operating this morning:

158884 + 159102
5Z77   BomoCSD   09:50   Bomo   10:09      
2Z77   Bomo   10:15   Weymth   11:10
5Z78   Weymth   11:25   BomoCSD   12:14

158885 + 159105
5Z79   BomoCSD   10:45   Bomo   11:00      
2Z79   Bomo   11:10   Weymth   12:01      
5Z80   Weymth   12:19   BomoCSD   13:10

Evening work for the 158/159s has not yet been allocated yet.

 

If SWT are using DMUs to allow existing timetabled services to run in longer formations, rather than as extras, they wouldn't necessarily need to publicise it at all.  People might just turn up and find a 158/159 combo (up to 10 cars) replacing a single 444, and another service running as a 10 car 444.

Paul

 
SWT have got round the juice problem by  using additional 158/159 into Weymouth, I've read on other forums, but havent found any thing from SWT showing they are doing this. They have hired an additional unit in from EMT. Although rumours elsewhere suggest swt drivers are refusing to drive it, due to lack of a locking door behind the cab. These same rumours suggest it will now be sub hired for the daily FGW hire from SWT.

 
A not so good start to the Cardiff Weymouth Olympic service - cancelled between Cardiff and Bristol. Wonder whether that has left many passengers stranded in Wales with no way to get to Weymouth at a sensible time - or did FGW make alternative provision?

 

I've heard that SWT will have a spare 158/159 if required

 
Thanks, paul7755.

I've taken the opportunity to merge that previous discussion with this topic, as it covers exactly the same subject.

Chris. 

 

It's been covered in a previous discussion on the same subject:

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=7656.0. 

Paul

 
Surprised no one has commented that SWT cannot provide additional capacity to Weymouth because of a shortage of 'juice'.  The third rail power supply is limited and restricts length and number of trains on the route.

I am not convinced that trains will be seriously overcrowded - most of the sailing types will go and stay in the vicinity of Weymouth for the duration and watching sailing from the shore is not a mass activity.  Those with boats will arrive from a variety of locations along the south coast.

 
Immediately before the old P7 was closed (nominally at last December's timetable change) the standard platforming was that Bournemouth trains used the old P8 (current P9); Newcastle - Readings used the old P7, and the Newcastle - Southamptons used P3 southbound and P7 northbound.

The current standard usage is that nearly all the Newcastle/Rdg/Southampton services use P3, and nearly all the Manchester - Bournemouths use P9.  However if there are delays they can use any of the through platforms or P3 as available.

Paul

 

I've seen Bmouth bound journeys from the bay platform at Reading, so you're not imagining it 

 
You'd need at least two extra 22x units just to extend the existing services to Weymouth - but that doesn't actually provide additional capacity on the overall route.   As shown in the XC May 2012 timetable despite being referred to as 'additional services' they are just the normal services from Man Picc and New St for the relevant time of day extended beyond Bournemouth (arr BMH 0914 and 1012), so the real problem is providing a couple of extra units ready at Bourmnemouth to form the corresponding north bound departures from Bournemouth (dep BMH 0945 and 1045). 

Paul

 


I've heard rumour elsewhere that XC will indeed be re-jigging their HST diagrams and utilising all sets.
[/quote]

You are correct as it is looking like this is crosscountrys plan to release some class 220/221 units to provide the extra capacity for services to be extended to Weymouth.

 

I've heard rumour elsewhere that XC will indeed be re-jigging their HST diagrams and utilising all sets.

 
Sorry, I was sure that XC used the bay platform at Reading, not long enough for a double Voyager.

Yes, hopefully all stock will be in use. Nevertheless, I wouldn't be surprised if XC run 3 car Tubostars TBH.

 
I think the best we can hope for is that all the Bournemouth/Weymouth diagrams use 5-car Voyagers throughout the sailing events.  Might mean the routes to the South West suffer slightly, but if XC are serious about providing the best service perhaps all their HSTs can be out and about as well?

 
Btline's point made in his post was about platforming longer XC trains at Reading being an issue - and that's all I was responding to.

Paul

 

Because they won't fit at Wareham? ISTR the max there is 8x20m.

There's also the question about where you'd berth stuff during their extended layovers at Weymouth - I'm not sure what you can fit down the quay tramway as far as the Melcombe Regis L/C. Putting a longer XC down Jersey sdgs might also cause problems with SWT/FGW berthings and shunts.

 

The normal platforming at Reading doesn't prevent existing Bournemouth trains being doubled up, because they usually use P9 to reverse, (although they are infrequent they do occur in the normal timetable). 

Therefore your assumption that there's a platforming reason to prevent the Weymouth extensions being 8,9 or 10 car 22x is wrong.   If you said they'd be unlikely to have enough stock I'd go along with that.

Paul 

 
Nice to see the return of limited stop services on the Bristol-Weymouth line allbeit only for a short while this summer.

 
I hope they are 5 car! I doubt they'll be double voyagers due to the platform at Reading.

So already rammed trains will have more people squeezing in! It's going to be chaos...

 
These are the additional XC services, apologies if someone has already posted them elsewhere:

The following additional CrossCountry train services will operate direct to and from Weymouth on the dates shown:
Mondays to Fridays 30 July to 10 August & Monday 3 to Thursday 6 September
06.04 Birmingham New Street to Weymouth (arrives 10.15)
05.11 Manchester Piccadilly to Weymouth (arrives 11.13)
17.41 Weymouth to Manchester Piccadilly (arrives 23.37)
18.30 Weymouth to Birmingham New Street (arrives 22.45)
11.35 Weymouth to Bournemouth (arrives 12.28) calling at Wareham (12.05) and Poole (12.16)
12.35 Bournemouth to Weymouth (arrives 13.23) calling at Poole (12.48) and Wareham (12.59)
Saturdays 4, 11 August & 1 September
06.04 Birmingham New Street to Weymouth (arrives 10.15)
05.11 Manchester Piccadilly to Weymouth (arrives 11.13)
17.35 Weymouth to Manchester Piccadilly (arrives 23.32)
18.36 Weymouth to Birmingham New Street (arrives 22.48)
11.35 Weymouth to Bournemouth (arrives 12.28) calling at Wareham (12.05) and Poole (12.16)
12.35 Bournemouth to Weymouth (arrives 13.23) calling at Poole (12.48) and Wareham (12.59)
Sundays 29 July, 5 August & 2 September
08.51 Southampton Central to Weymouth (arrives 10.08)
18.38 Weymouth to Birmingham New Street (arrives 22.42)
10.38 Weymouth to Bournemouth arrives (11.24) calling at Wareham (11.04) and Poole (11.15)
11.35 Bournemouth to Weymouth arrives (12.22) calling at Poole (11.44) and Wareham (11.55)

All Voyagers I'm afraid as our HSTs can't go South of Reading.

 

Actually the loco hauled set was planned to be used on the Cardiff - Taunton route, I think the same as the original loco hauled  diagram this would have freed up one of the 3 carriage class 150's

 

I'm not surprised, if they bought in a loco hauled set the extra capacity would soon be eroded by railfans riding it 

 
....and FGW now have more units in the Bristol area to play around with.

I suspect things will be jiggered around with to provide a 4 or 5 car service for the 0700 from Cardiff and 1800 from Weymouth.

A HST would be nice for the weekend extra services though.....

 
Weymouth has had 2 trains per hour from Waterloo since 2007 - effectively making 9-10 carriages per hour (depending whether the semi-fast service is a 444 or 450) and nearly 600 standard class seats. Although I've rarely used it in mid-summer, my personal experience is that SWT services seem to be very lightly loaded south of Dorchester. Still, the DfT specified 2 trains per hour due to the Olympics so we'll see how that works.

FGW Bristol-Weymouth services are always very popular on sunny days in the school holidays anyway so I assume FGW will take this into account.

 
Indeed: Worcester is generally over-provided for in HST services anyway. 

 
A HST set could always be taken off a Cotswold Line diagram.

 

 

That's all very well, old boy, but where are those additional HSTs to be conjured from? 

 
I wa told FGW had decided to not hire in a loco hauled rake to release  some dmu's to provide extra capacity for the olympic's.

That 07:00 from Cardiff to Bristol is currently the crosscountry service to Manchester so that has been cut back to Bristol TM I believe

 
No HST services from FGW are running to Weymouth for the Olympics!  The Additional services mentioned above are rumouring to consist of 5 car DMU consist ( A 3 and 2 car Class 158 ) but this is just a rumour I have heard so can't confirm for sure!

 
It's ridiculous that no more efforts have gone into improving Weymouth's rail service. Not even 10 car trains to to Weymouth from Waterloo. HSTs should be run to Weymouth from B'ham and London Padd.

The budget has been bled dry. Hasn't stopped lots of new DLR lines that'l probably run half empty post Olympics...

As for Stratford International - it's a joke. To get to Canary Wharf you have to change, or walk to Stratford BR so it's pointless for Kent commuters.

 
Just checked the new May 2012 timetables and these show one additional return train Cardiff to Weymouth during the two Olympic "fortnights." These depart Cardiff ca 07.00 and Weymouth ca 18.00 every day, calling at principal stations only.

At least the higher powers have offered some extra provision for the sailing enthusiasts travelling on the Heart of Wessex route. Any gossip on whether these might be formed of HSTs? HST stop boards have been provided over the past two years and Network Rail have been busy track fettling (very necessary) in recent months especially south of Castle Cary and at Maiden Newton.

 

When was this? 158/159 are already cleared Branksome-Dorchester Jcn, albeit with speed restrictions, and 158s run regularly Dorchester Jcn - Weymouth and have done for years. There is overnight 444 regen testing last/this week but not sure if they involve 158/159 stock or even an off-lease 460. Will try to find out more.

 
SWT say they cannot run extra services due to 'power supply restrictions'. That wouldn't be relevant if they were to run 158/159s. Perhaps the DfT and Olympic Delivery Authority have asked SWT to look again at train provision to Weymouth during the Olympics.

 
Unlikely to be relevant.  SWT have stated quite explicitly that they aren't running any extra services to Weymouth.


Paul

 
Not sure if it's related, but SWT have been route clearing a 158/159 combo between Bournemouth, Wareham, Dorchester South and Weymouth in the last week.
L

 
Ummm, oh wait panic over I just read the rest of the thread

 
No problem. But you owe me 4 cotton buds. And    my    space    bar         keeps        sticking.

 
Aha, oops - sorry about that.

 
Ollie. You scamp. Followed your link and just wasted a mouthful of rather nice Marky Sparks French lager. 

 
I can't be certain as yet, but it might be to do with this: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=8609.msg87452#msg87452

 
See http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=8315.msg84183#msg84183

I have nothing specific yet to add to that particular post - but I'm working on it.  

Chris from Nailsea.  

 

....and, here we are again. Let the speculation begin..... 

 
I wonder if FGW will hire a loco hauled train  to provide extra capacity duiring the olympics?

Anyone heard what FGW  are planning on using for the additional workings to Weymouth  this year?

 
SWT confirmed in today's webchat that they will not be providing any extra services to Weymouth for the Olympics.  As I've always thought, the Dec 2007 upgrade to 2tph was all that was possible.

They do mention that FGW and XC will be running some extra trains.

Paul

 
I  am sure that i did take a shot of a virgin HST at Weymouth going back a few years ago ( Must have been a good 12 years ago )  although i will have to do a bit of searching for it. Will let  you know if/when i find it.

 
Great pic BNM, thanks for posting it. Oh how a train like this is greatly missed. Wish I appreciated them more when they were running now that tin cans on wheels now dominate XC.

 
Making me all nostalgic for the days of 47s through Oxford that is! Lovely bit of thrash from those things pulling away...

 
Not been able to find a picture of a VXC HST at Weymouth, but I did find a pic of a VXC 47+MkIIs from 2001 on the Sulzerpower.com website:
(c)2000-2011 THE CLASS 47 LIST, Ian Hall and Shaun C. This material may be distributed only subject to the terms and conditions set forth in the Open Publication License, v1.0

 
I'm sure I have seen a picture somewhere of a Virgin XC HST at Weymouth but I can't remember where. If I do find it I will let you know.

 


Yes. The Weymouth service was withdrawn in September 2002, by which time the Voyagers had taken over. The book shown here shows a Voyager on that line if anyone has an urge to see it:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dorset-Further-Selection-British-Railways/dp/1858952190/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1298213589&sr=8-1

I don't think a Crosscountry HST has ever worked to Wemouth though.

 
Don't forget that the Dorking area will see the Cycling Road Races on Saturday 28th July (mens) and Sunday 29th July (womens). The men's route will take do a circuit of Box Hill 9 times and the women's race will do it 3 times.   

 
Up to 50,000 visitors are expected to watch the sailing events during the Olympic and Paralympic Games in 2012. From BBC quote above.

Is that over the whole time or per day?

They (ODA) are quoting 30,000 a day for Dorney Rowing. Which is at least two miles from the nearest railhead down narrow lanes and up to a mile walk  from the Park and Ride and coach drop off at Windsor Racecourse.

Anyone want to rent a house in Taplow for the duration only offers > ^3k accepted? Or does this contravene the Boards rules about advrtising.

 
Through services from Birmingham I understand, extension on current Bournemouth terminators. Issues with Sundays due to the later start up, but maye be a service starting from Reading, in addition to one from Birmingham.

 
rts. Do you know where these provisionally planned XC services are originating from? And the route to Weymouth they will be taking?

 
Not to my knowledge, 220020 made it to Swanage to be named Wessex Voyager. Think the Summer Saturdays to Weymouth continued until 2002 which would give some overlap with the initial introduction of Voyagers from late 2001.

 
Has a Voyager ever made it to Weymouth before Virgin withdrew summer Saturday workings?

 
XC are provisionally being asked to plan for 2tpd Mon-Sat and 1tpd Sun in each direction. Very little else can be done with the amount of rolling stock available to us.

 
From the BBC: